Hell for Leather is reporting that all is not well at the new Norton Motorcycles despite Stuart Garner’s very public campaign to demonstrate the vitality of his effort to revive the iconic brand.
The HFL story originated with a piece from BikerGlory, and it includes some serious allegations.
We thought it might be a good idea to check out what the majordomo at Norton has to say about the issues raised in the most recent stories about the health his company.
As you might guess, Mr. Garner begs to differ with the conclusions drawn by some critics on the web and in the British motorcycle building fraternity.
Garner took the time to answer some of the bombs thrown his way recently by firing back at the naysayers in this exclusive Q&A with Motorcycleinsurance.com:
The critics are saying Norton Motorcycles has consistently failed to fill orders on time and there have been problems with holding deposits. Any truth to those criticisms?
SG: In the last two years we have delivered many hundreds of motorcycles into the UK. Due to great demand and a difficult UK supply chain, it has sometimes taken longer than we would have liked to deliver customers bikes. The supply chain issue is the primary reason. When our very first bike built left the factory, we had 200 suppliers. Now we have less than 100 suppliers, which is an indicator of the challenges that we’ve had selecting the best suppliers. Suppliers that are able to both make quality parts and deliver on-time. It is also an indicator of just how much work and investment we have done to bring a huge amount of manufacturing in-house at our factory at the Donington Park race circuit.
Any customer who does not want to wait for their new Norton can ask for a refund at any time. I can also say that all refund requests have been settled in full. Customers’ deposit money is very safe. We should take a moment to look at the up-market car industry. Those manufacturers regularly have long waiting times and routinely require a deposit from a potential customer up-front at the time of purchase. The reason they do this is to form a fair and transparent waiting list, which you join at the time of your deposit. This then gives the buyer a proper position for delivery and shows a clear commitment from them thereby ensuring they simply do not walk away leaving the manufacturer during the building process. At Norton, all bikes are hand-built to order in a similar way to a bespoke and up-market car. This is why we use a deposit style system for direct sales to UK customers only. This is the key differentiator between Norton and other motorcycle manufacturers that use traditional assembly line processes and build speculatively. The relatively small amount of deposit money held at any one time makes no difference to the funding of the company. When we do take an order, the price for the motorcycle is fixed at the time of deposit. Some customers have placed orders at the fixed price and due to factory increases after ordering they have benefitted by well over £1,000 at delivery time. Our website [www.nortonmotorcycles.com] carries regular news so you can follow the factory progress
Is it true customers have waited almost two years for a bike?
SG: The Commando 961 was launched at the NEC UK Motorcycle show in 2009, we had a huge amount of interest and established a UK order book. All these bikes have now been built and delivered. We do have a small number of customers who have waited over a year. We were overwhelmed by demand and we should have been much more cautious on delivery dates. Hindsight is of course a wonderful thing, but if we had to do it over again we would have advised much longer delivery times to customers. Generally the longer waiting bikes are dual seat models that have been ordered with specifications chosen by the customer around 18 months ago. The delay here has been for the tooling of the new seat moulding. This particular issue is the fault of Norton as we had tooling problems with the first design and had to redo the drawings which took a long period of drawing time to get right. I apologize to all of our customers who have had to wait beyond the period of time which they were quoted, and I thank them for their patience.
Some are saying Norton can’t provide spare parts and that you’re having problems dealing with suppliers.
SG: Norton maintains a good stock of parts at the factory and this has not been an issue for some time. Iit has taken time to grow our parts stock as we were faced with having to choose between supplying our dealer network with spares or continuing to manufacturer new Norton motorcycles. This issue was again a standard issue facing a start-up manufacturing business. Again, due to the increased manufacturing capability that we have in-house within the Norton factory, we are able to meet our part needs both for manufacturing and for our dealers. I have transparently tried to set out where Norton is right now. Turning to suppliers, I have a personal belief of keeping the Norton factory as British as possible. We have a mind-blowing choice of Japanese and other brands bikes out there. With Norton we have the chance to bring back a fabulous brand in an authentic way. Norton motorcycles are manufactured using quality British-made parts to assemble a truly hand-built bike. Unfortunately as we all know the halcyon days of the British motorcycle industry passed by many years ago. This left the UK with only the bare bones of a suitable supply chain. It has taken a huge amount of effort to re-educate and engage the supply chain in the UK back to the requirements of a production motorcycle business. As stated earlier we started with some 200 suppliers and stand here today with less than 100, some suppliers just don’t want the work as the aerospace, oil industry or military markets keep them busy and pay top prices. Making parts to a limited volume and having the discipline of regular timely supply is not the demands some suppliers want or can actually achieve. Having worked hard at this for over two years now we have an amazing nucleus of UK suppliers emerging, this is great news and bodes really well for the years ahead. Not just for Norton but the knock on effect of all the jobs being created at these suppliers with the Norton orders coming through to them.
A couple of your most vocal critics, Fritz Egli and Nigel Gibson, are pretty adamant in their criticisms of you and Norton, how did those relationships sour?
SG: I do not think it is polite or appropriate for me to comment to much on individuals who have or had vested commercial interests in Norton. However, I will say Norton respects Fritz and his business, you simply have to listen and respect someone who has been around forever and achieved as much as he has. We continue to work closely with his company and have been shipping bikes and parts recently.
I make no excuse or apology whatsoever for moving supply to more professional suppliers and am not surprised to learn that previous suppliers speak negatively of the company. Norton has a duty to its customers to supply a best quality hand built motorcycle on time; suppliers that do not help us achieve this let everyone down and must be replaced. There are over 1,000 components to our bike, and if just one supplier lets us down we cannot complete a bike. This in turn means we let the customer down by failing to deliver their bike on time and we let the rest of the supply chain down as our volume drops and we buy less parts from them – a vicious cycle. Ex-suppliers should look at themselves and ask why they failed, an element of honesty to themselves would help rather than blaming everyone else…
Is Norton in financial trouble?
SG: Norton is today in better financial health than it ever has been. It is a hugely expensive undertaking to simultaneously bring back an iconic brand and a manufacturing business.. For sure we have had highs and lows in cash-flow, this is quite common in start-up manufacturing businesses. We have managed these highs and lows whilst continually investing for the long-term in the items that the company needs to make a quality motorcycle. Today the company is well-financed to take on both today’s challenges and those further ahead in the coming years.
The signing of Pierre Terblanche to design the new Norton models drew quite a lot of positive press at the time it was announced. What led Terblanche to resign his post with Norton?
SG: Looking back I’m not sure Norton were experienced enough or ready for Pierre; equally I think Pierre found it difficult coming from an industry giant to Norton.
What led you to pursue competition in the Isle of Man races and why are the critics on your case about how your participation there was handled?
SG: Norton has a huge history with the TT races. We won the first race in 1907 and have won many since. Everyone at the factory wants to race, and it’s a great way to test new ideas and components while giving the brand a level of global awareness in a way that is unique. We know that some people questioned why we put an Aprilia V4 engine into the bike. This was done for both cost and reliability reasons. It takes a several years and a few million pounds to develop an engine that is capable of winning at the TT. As CEO I would be irresponsible to commit such funds to a racing effort when we are still investing and building up our road bike business. We felt we should go to the TT to begin the learning process of what is required both from a chassis perspective and of course to learn what is required from an engine. We need this knowledge in order to slowly develop our race platform at a rate that is viable. Racing also allows us to bring this knowledge in-house where we can develop new capability, wisely using the data we have captured. Currently our total race budget is made up from sponsorship, road bike suppliers and team clothing sales. No funding at all comes from the factory and, I am not prepared to gamble the future of Norton on racing. Only when it is financially viable will we spend funds on racing. We understand some of the different views of what constitutes a Norton, but we must balance them against some of the personally vested interests and passionate support for other brands. In other words, fans of competing brands will always have negative things to say about Norton. I would ask our Norton loyalists for the patience to let us develop at a pace that is suitable to the business we have today and the business we want to have in the future. I passionately want what we all want: a 100% built Norton on the Senior podium. We’ve started the journey…
You’ve taken on a major task in reviving a brand beloved by motorcyclists around the world. What do you see as the challenges and responsibilities of your company going forward?
SG: The challenge is to get a quality motorcycle to market that is fit for the brand and something that all stakeholders can be proud of. The responsibility is not to mess that up!
Have you read the articles on Hell for Leather and other sites? And if so, can you take the time to respond to the claims made by the various sources mentioned in those posts?
SG: I’m generally in the factory seven days a week and do not read forums or other types of posts. I do listen to credible advice and opinion of course, but I also take care not to get too distracted. As mentioned, reviving a brand of such iconic stature is a daunting challenge, one at which I am determined to succeed. Understandably there will always be many opinions on the best way to accomplish this. However there are reasons why former employees and former suppliers are no longer with Norton. Their opinions remain their own and will not influence the forward direction of the brand or its strategy. We do listen carefully to experienced engineers within our supply chain as well as our knowledgeable and experienced staff. There are good reasons Britain lost its entire famous bike manufacturer, it is no easy task keeping British supplied and hand built, simple as that. However both I and the Norton team are committed to working hard to put Norton back on the map.
In a perfect world, what characteristics should define a Norton Motorcycle and why should a rider want a new one?
SG: We believe our British heritage is key. We now have the opportunity to bring back an authentically hand-built British bike. We will never make tens of thousands of bikes or have hundreds of dealers globally. These factors will continue to make the bike an exclusive and sought-after machine, which in turn gives great pride of ownership. All these factors together then help the residual price stay very high, meaning that the bike will hold its value over the long-term. Here in the UK used bikes still command a premium over new.
You’re obviously a man of means. Why did you take on the challenge of reviving one of the iconic brands in the history of motorcycle building?
SG: Ever since I was at Donington watching the JPS Norton’s winning the Super Cup, I’ve loved the brand. I had an opportunity to bring the brand back. Who on earth would turn that down!?
What kind of rider needs a Norton?
SG: Norton has a huge pedigree and over the years has built up an iconic status. For riders wanting huge speed and cheap performance, Norton motorcycles are not for you. If you want to enjoy real-world fun motorcycling and value the pride of ownership, we are the logical choice. We are looking to build exclusive beautiful bikes for the rider that enjoys all the things that motorcycling can bring. Our owners range from 24 to 82 years of age and from all walks of life. Motorcycling has a habit of leveling all the classes and when riding it brings us all together.
Given the difficulties inherent in manufacturing a product, are you sorry you made the effort to revive the brand?
SG: Not one day have I ever regretted doing this. The Norton factory has a very special buzz about it. The staff here is amazing and are dedicated and committed to building quality bikes. It has been a complete privilege to be involved. Very many of our customers have become personal friends as have suppliers and dealers, in all an incredible experience.
Looking back, what critical decisions would you change in your efforts to re-define and revitalize Norton Motorcycles?
SG: My one and only regret is the time we have taken to deliver early customer bikes. I truly wish we could turn the clock back and do a better job setting expectations, communicating and meeting our delivery schedules. We are working hard and have now got on top of this, but we have let some people down and for that I’m sorry. The whole team is committed to building Norton back into a world-class manufacturing business.
What bikes are you riding now?
SG: Norton 961 Cafe Racer
In your opinion, what’s the greatest motorcycle ever made?
SG: Norton 30M
If you had one thing to say to anyone who’s considering buying a new Norton Motorcycle, what would that be?
SG: You can trust both the factory and our dealers to support and look after you as one of the Norton family. This is not just for a new sale, but for many years after as you enjoy the pleasure of ownership that your Norton brings.
It’s a tough market at the moment for motorcycle manufacturers. Who do you see as the top players in your market segment?
SG: Norton are quite different in our market position and don’t really have direct competitors for the Commando 961. Generally I think the quality US and European brands will do well going forwards, while the Japanese segment is crowded both in brands and models. This segment is going to come under increasing attack from other Far East manufacturers. These bikes are sold on numbers, price, horsepower, and speed. It’s an ever decreasing circle and looks really difficult for the companies to make money in this economic environment.
This week a man in Nashville, Tenn. was taken to the hoosegow after authorities caught him – and an accomplice – stealing several motorcycles from sellers who had advertised on Craigslist. To further complicate matters, some of the buyers who bought the bikes from the thieves then resold the bikes.
One Jerry Pinkerton finds himself in hot water for a series of Craigslist-centered felony thefts. The 30-year-old Pinkerton answered ads for motorcycles for sale, told the owners he wanted to “test drive” the bikes, and then just kept on riding and left the sellers waiting for his return.
Pinkerton and his alleged accomplice, Richard Roberts, resold the bikes, and authorities now say the pair were responsible for stealing half dozen motorcycles.
After unraveling the whole sorry scam, Nashville Police officials say those who unknowingly purchased the stolen bikes are out their cash as well.
“We recovered four cycles last night from one guy who bought them,” said a Nashville cop.
Pinkerton said he recently sold a stolen motorcycle to a man in Wilson County.
The whole affair brings up a couple of important points you need to consider if you’re selling a bike.
One, don’t let anyone “test drive” your vehicle before they hand you their driver’s license and two, don’t buy or sell a motorcycle without a title changing hands or at the very least, a notarized bill of sale.
A guy says he wants to buy the bike, but it has to be PayPal, and he’ll give you a certain sum for your motorcycle and says he’ll add a sum to the transaction for you to handle the shipping for the bike. The shippers show up, you hand them the “buyer’s” money to cover the shipping, and they leave.
You’re happy. End of story.
Except, it actually ends up this way:
Your bike reaches the shipping destination, the “buyer’s” pals load it off the dock and drive off. Within a few hours, the “buyer” contacts PayPal and reports the entire transaction as a fraudulent one. PayPal gets back to the “buyer” and finds the bike was delivered to a state other than the “buyer’s” address. The “buyer” tells them, “Why would I have a bike delivered to Connecticut? I live in New Jersey.”
PayPal says, “Yeah, why would you have a bike delivered to Connecticut?” They check out the signature on the shipping bill, which of course you signed when the shippers showed up, and they tell the “buyer” they’ll remove the transaction – and then come after you for the whole amount.
It will all work out in the end when the authorities find out the PayPal transaction was charged to a stolen credit card, but in the interim, you will be seriously annoyed – and out one motorcycle.
It might also go something like this, and we’ll call it The Nigerian Gambit:
- You’re trying to sell a used motorcycle on the Internet.
- You’re contacted via e-mail by a “prospective buyer” who agrees to the asked-for price and offers to have someone pick up and ship the bike and pay all the shipping charges.
- The “buyer” tells you he’ll send a cashier’s check for more than the agreed-upon price for the vehicle, but you have to send the “extra cash” to a third party to handle the shipping and costs.
- The cashier’s check arrives, you deposit it, and a few days later, the check appears to have cleared.
- Since it’s all gone as advertised, you send the “extra money” to the guy who is scheduled to get your bike and start waiting for someone to show up and take it away.
- No one ever comes to pick up the vehicle.
- A couple of weeks go by, and you’re suddenly informed that the cashier’s check you deposited, and that “cleared the bank,” was a forgery.
- Goodbye money you sent to the “pal” of the buyer who was handling the “shipping.”
How do you avoid falling for this or some variant scam?
- Just don’t get involved in any sale where the buyer wants you to accept a check and “refund” any other amount.
- If you accept a cashier’s check as payment for something, make sure it clears the issuing bank – not your bank – before you hand over your property. That could take up to two or three weeks, so hold on to whatever you sold for those three weeks – or until you know the funds were good from the issuing bank.
The moral of the story is this: you never sell a motorcycle, or for that matter anything of value, without seeing some identification and transferring title before the item leaves your possession. Never.
Feel free to use PayPal, it’s a great way to handle transactions, but make sure you have some ID from the buyer should anything turn south later. Even a “cashiers check transaction” can bite you in the ass, so do things right and make sure you know who you’re dealing with before you close the deal…
If you do get scammed? Call the U.S. Secret Service at (202) 406-5572 and the consumer protection division of your state attorney general’s office and save someone else the same headache.
One of the things I love most about the whole world of motorcycles is the completely over the top array of characters you meet on the road, around town, or hanging out working on or watching someone work on bikes.
Working on motorcycles is an acquired skill which, given enough years standing over various basket case jobs, can rise to the level of an art form. The old school motorcycle mechanic has seen it all and possesses all the shortcuts, tricks and knowledge to get damn near any bike back on the road. Part engineer, part electronics expert, and all grease monkey, the old school guys also tend to get touchy – a little like lawyers – at always being asked for free advice.
They can, at their best, also be a little like doctors as they diagnose and recommend treatment for their seriously ill “patients,” and this guy, though his bedside manner could use a touch of polish, might some day be the only thing between your bike and a trip to the boneyard.
This guy might be a little grouchy, but like nearly everyone in the motorcycle fraternity, he’s also willing to lend a hand even if you are a “cheap bastard” looking for a free ride.
This is the official Channel of HHH Cycles Motorcycle repair, restoration and customization
257 Seaboard Ave
Venice, Florida 34293
The doctor is in…
|Date: Jul 6, 2015, 1:00 PM|
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Sally Halterman, the first American woman issued a motorcycle license.
Pin Up Girls On Indian & Harley Motorcycle Classics
What is it about the WWII era pin up art, often found painted on the noses and bodies of WWII era airplanes. This is one style that seems to be holding up quite nicely after all these years and continue to be popular with motorcycle riders, especially with classic Harley and vintage Indian motorcycles.
Normally we don’t go much into the cheesecake in the pages of American Iron Harley magazine or on line here at Classic American Iron Magazine, but we thought this was fun. How about something a bit earlier like this?
Or how about something like this (don’t you love these?)
And one more showing how the sexy pin up girl and Harley motorcycles can be used for advertising these days
From inspiration, performance, design to brilliant engines. In the quest of motorcycle past, we are always likely to to find astonishing treasures which makes our life interesting.